Insoles and inseaming

[j1a2g3]

DWFFII

I'm so thick!!!

The pictures helped a lot. I figured out what the feather is. I thought it was the stitching groove when I was looking at Laszlo Vass "Shoes for Men".

How do you cut the feather without messing up the side of the insole?

Thanks Joel

[dw]

Joel,

there's probably half a dozen ways to do it...from cutting the featehr by hand to grooving it to special tools called feathering knives.

Myself, I use and American Channel knife:

http://www.thehcc.org/forum/viewtopic.php?t=2145

and a french edger or you could even use a welt knife like the Berg that Al showed on the same page above.

The Am. Channeler will cut (straight down) an adjustable depth and inward from the edge of the insole an adjustable width. From that point it is a simple matter to take that strip out with a french edger leaving a rabbeted edge.

Tight Stitches
DWFII--Member HCC

[j1a2g3]

DWFII

I haven't been able to find an American Channeler. Do you know where I could get one.
Joel

PS: I just sent a check for: Western Bootmaking, An American Tradition. I can't wait.

[dw]

Joel,

Usually you can find them on Ebay...just search for "leather tool(s)" or "shoe tool(s)"...although there doesn't seem to be any listed just now. I usually check once a week for interesting tools. If I run across one I'll email it to you.


Tight Stitches
DWFII--Member HCC

[j1a2g3]

DWFII

Thanks, that would be great.

Joel

[dw]

Gang,

Here's a little Christmas present from Saint Nickolas...

the toe wiping video--10 minutes 40mb

A few comments...all tacks are driven through the wiping strip and into the feather or outside channel. I didn't make this as clear as I would have liked in the video. Tacks that stray from the feather...especially towards the upper, may leave visible holes after inseaming. So...forewarned is forearmed.

Again, thanks to Tom Mickel for the camera work. He said that he had never done this sort of thing before but he did a far better job than another who was supposedly trained. The best part is that he kept the focus on the work and not on the demonstrator.

Hope you enjoy and Merry Christmas to all.

Tight Stitches
DWFII--Member HCC

[relferink]

[j1a2g3]

DW Great Video!!!

I just started to cut out my insole from the soling shoulder and noticed different grain or texture on the flesh side. Sections of the leather seem denser or the grain is closer to together and others seem looser and you can see strands of fibers, for no other better way to describe it. Does it make a differnece which part I cut for the insole?

Also, does it make a difference how I lay the insole pattern down, directional wise?

Thanks in advance, Joel

[dw]

Joel,

Thanks to you and Robert.

I think the most important thing is to match the insoles for tightness and thickness. You don't want to have one insole be flanky and the other be tight. Nor one an 8 iron and the other a 7.

As for direction, I've never felt it mattered but others may have different opinions. I think it does matter that both be oriented in the same direction, of course, but, beyond that, since I use heavy "bull" shoulders (if I can get them) the main thing I try to avoid is allowing a fat wrinkle to run across the insole. Lengthwise it doesn't seem to bother but if the fat wrinkle is running across the insole the insole will tend to bend or flex there--maybe exactly in opposition to where the foot itself actually wants to flex. Such factors could severely impinge on the insoles role in forming a comfortable footbed.

Tight Stitches
DWFII--Member HCC

[paul]

DW,

Once again it was a pleasure to watch your dexterity.

Thank you for your instruction.

I sure do like seeing it again.

PK

[shoestring]

DW
I ditto.... Paul, these lessons are invaluable and unforgettable,like they say seeing is beliving......... .

Ed

[j1a2g3]

I,m about to prepunch the holes in my insole and was wondering how wide do people make their Holdfast? Thanks in advance, Joel

[dw]

Joel,

I make mine a little wider than a quarter inch but I am certain this will vary with the maker and perhaps even the type of shoe being made. I've seen the holdfast be as little as one-eighth inch (in commercial stuff).

Bottom line...it's got to be wide enough to provide support and security for the inseam (at three stitches to the inch) but be narrow enough to not impede the free movement of the sewing awl.

Tight Stitches
DWFII--Member HCC

[j1a2g3]

Here are two pictures of my insole. The 1st one I have Feathered and Channeled. The 2nd, I prepunched the inseaming holes. Any comments or advice would be greatly appreciated. Joel

4619.jpg

4620.jpg

[dw]

Joel,

Depending on how you intend to attach the outsole, I might venture to suggest that the feather is about two or three times too wide.

The welt will butt up to the holdfast when you are done inseaming and, done as you have done it, will nearly disappear under the edge of the insole. If you are going to sew the outsole on by hand, this may not be an insurrmountable problem, but if you want to use a outsole stitcher, it will be dern near impossible.

On the other hand, I can envision sewing the vamp to the holdfast with no welt added at all and then going to a cement construction or a full peg job to attach the outsole.

The holdfast is perhaps a little wide but well within reason.

Your holing is just a little long too unless you don't trust the insole leather.

You've definitely got the right idea, though. Keep at it.

Tight Stitches
DWFII--Member HCC

[j1a2g3]

DW

Thanks for the response.

Could you explain what you mean by; " Your holing is just a little long" you lost me completely there.

I will pull off the insoles and try agian. I'm I correct in that the feather and holdfast should be about 1/4" wide for each of them?

[j1a2g3]

DW

Sorry, but this just fascinates me.

I just went back and re-read the chapter in your book on feathering and channeling. Am I correct in assuming the holdfast is just about 1/8" wide?

Also, does the vamp sit on the feather and butt up agianist the holdfast? What did you mean by "disappearing under the insole" in your previous post?

Thanks for all your help, Joel

[dw]

Joel,

For a starter, I'd make the feather about an eighth of an inch wide...not much wider than that. Some makers don't even cut a feather--they hole right out the side of the insole.

The holdfast, I'd make a tiny bit wider than a quarter of an inch wide and your holes should be spaced three to the inch...no further apart. That's roughly five-sixteenth of an inch. So the width of the holdfast and the length of the stitch are about the same.

The awl and thread of the waxed end pierce the holdfast, the vamp lining, the vamp and the welt. When the stitch is drawn tight, it pulls the lining the vamp and the edge of the welt into the feather and up against the holdfast. If the feather is too wide, the welt will be pulled too far under the edge of the insole.

Tight Stitches
DWFII--Member HCC

[j1a2g3]

DWF11
Here's my 2nd try at cutting the feather and channel in my insole. It's a size 8 1/2 last.
\image {2nd insole picture}

When you said; "holing a little to long", did you mean the awl is coming out to low on the holdfast or in the feather? I thought the hole should be where the hodlfast and feather meet. Is that right?

(Message edited by j1a2g3 on December 29, 2006)

(Message edited by j1a2g3 on December 29, 2006)

[j1a2g3]

Try this picture agian.

4622.jpg

[dw]

Joel,

I think that's a lot closer...might even be usable.

If it were me, I'd like the feather to be a little narrower yet and the holdfast a bit wider still.

As for holing...what I meant was that the holes should be closer to each other--three to the inch or even a tidge closer.

Yes, the hole should come out of the holdfast exactly at that corner where the holdfast and the feather meet.

Hope that helps.

(ps. use a ruler if you have to...just til you get a feel for eighth inch, quarter inch, third of an inch, etc.)

Tight Stitches
DWFII--Member HCC

[j1a2g3]

I think I have it this time.

4626.jpg

Thanks DW for all your help, Joel

[dw]

Joel,

Much, much better, in my opinion.

The holdfast is just a little wide, however. Especially on the lateral side. Remember that the curved section of sewing awl needs to be a tidge wider than the holdfast so that the tip of the awl can reach far enough to penetrate the lining, vamp, and welt.

Here's two photos of the way I go about this operation [remember that there may be other opinions and other ways of doing this--some may think my holdfast too wide, some may think them too narrow, some may prefer a wider feather...etc.., I'm just illustrating my own druthters and what has worked for me]

4628.jpg

4629.jpg

Tight Stitches
DWFII--Member HCC

[j1a2g3]

I went back and trimmed some off the inside of the holdfast, on the lateral side. I will start holing it as soon a my haft & awl arrive from Dick Anderson. Pic's to follow.

Thanks DW for all your help, Joel

[j1a2g3]

Justed recieved the Haft & Awl from Dick Anderson. What a difference between his and the one I got from School. Here's a Pic of my holed insole. Any comments would be greatly appreciated. Joel

4642.jpg