The Crispin Colloquy

Does anyone know where I can get a manual for a 5-in-1?

I've found one dead cheap and I'll be picking it up on Thursday.

I think it's a Frobana clone, not a Landis original. Am I right in assuming they're all basically the same?

Thanks.

Dear Alasdair,

I've been looking for one too with no luck. I've also been looking for the 5th function of the machine (lol). Could u let us know if the manual your purchasing is helpful?

Tia

Hi all,

I just got myself a 5-in-1, which they seem to call a 'ranger' here, presumably because it's used for cutting 'ranges' of sole leather.


It's a "Dania" brand:



I got it cheap and it needs a bit of cleaning up but mechanically it seems sound, if a touch worn in places.

More pictures can be found in my picasa albums here.

I've got a couple of questions. Firstly, should the skiver knife be single bevelled (like a chisel) or double-bevelled like a regular knife? The one in the machine isn't in a good state and probably needs to be replaced totally.

The other question is are the parts on these fairly universal between brands? I need a new rotary cutter for it and the only supplier here sells "Rodi" brand cutters (for almost a third more than I paid for the whole machine!).

I found a parts diagram for a Landis American 5-in-1 and as far as I can tell what I have is part-for-part identical but I've never laid my hands on another one so I don't know.

I'm having trouble finding any mention of "Dania" brand machines via Google and I don't want to fork out heaps for a cutter that isn't going to fit the one I have.

Thanks.

Very nice! the skiving blade is single beveled and usually has enough material to be sharpened many times before it is no longer adjustable. Rotary blades for this style run about $70 Canadian here.

Thanks Jask. The blade in this one is well stuffed then, it's been badly sharpened on both sides. I have a sneaking suspicion that a block plane blade will fit right in that gap though. I'll find out tomorrow.

I have recently bought a new blade/skiving knife for my cutter which has a longer arm but same as 5 in 1 and the knife was beveled on both sides of the steel.

Nasser

My 5-in-1 has a blade sharpened from both sides as well. I have had a number o0f these machines and they all had double-beveled blades. On the other hand, all my splitters have had single-beveled blades.

Tight Stitches
DWFII--HCC Member

Alasdair,

Some information you might be able to use.

I located my calipers and performed some measurements on the circular cutting blade for my landis 5-in-1. The following are the measurements.


Terry

Terry, you are a godsend. Thank you for that, and for all the help you've given me in email over the last little while.

Alasdair,

Unfortunately I do not know if the blade is a metric or english thread. If you determine that everything else matches, and you look at buying one of these, I can take the blade to a hardware store and try different threaded bolts to determine which it would be, so you can be sure of getting the correct item.

Let me know if this would help.

Terry

Terry

Alasdair,

I forgot to mention. The accuracy on my caliper is listed as .02mm.

Terry

I have been running around looking at skiving blades and it has been educational... I have found the one I have here and another ( a power 5in1) had single bevel blades, but all of the others (4 machines) had the double bevel. I also used each and the double bevel blades seem to do a better job on thin material. The double bevels I looked at did not seem to be symmetrical- the top bevel was twice as deep as the bottom bevel.
As far as the rotary blades go, Colin at Labelle supply said they had several different blades just for the Landis pattern so if you know the make and model you should be able to acquire a blade without too much trouble.

Hi All

A while back someone asked about the 5th function of a 5 in 1 bench machine. According to the Landis book that I just got hold of the five function are, sole cutter,sole and heel trimmer, welt roller, edge beveler, and skiver. The edge beveler is the one function I didn't know about. It permits one to thin the edge of heavy soles, which I tried this last week and it worked great.

Now long those same lines does anyone knows where I can locate a Landis Model 27 Stitch impression Machine.

Mike

"Well, I'll be a blue nosed gofer."

Edge beveler, huh? For 39 yrs. I never knew anybody who knew. Thank you Mike. Now I can put that mystery to rest.

So what is it, just an adjustment on the skiveing guide, and then skived all around the sole edge?

Paul

Mike:

I don't know what a Stitch Impression Machine is, but Tim Noonan has a hand/foot operated device to put stitch impressions in the welt of a shoe. It has interchangeable wheels like fudge wheels, with different stitch lengths. The wheels go on a hand-operated crank, and the shoe welt is pressed against the wheel by a foot operated lever that raises a wheel akin to the welt roller on the 5-in-1. Hope that makes sense. If that sounds like what you're looking for, e-mail Tim (find his e-mail via the member info here on the HCC).

Lance

Lance,

The machine you described is what I'm looking for thanks for the lead.

Paul,

Glad I could help, I've been in the dark for alot of years too.

Mike

Mike,

I have one of them stitch impression machines with 3 different wheels and operates as lance described,Always referred to it as the fudge wheel machine for lack of better term,but here is the made information of my machine and all that is written on it,it may help in your search to find one.
AMERICAN
S.M.&T.CO.
ST.LOUIS
Good luck.

Nasser

Nasser,

Do you have a photo of the stitch impression machine?

- rick

I got one of those bench-mounted foot-hand fudge wheels, used, from Blase Knable at Shoe Systems Plus in Goshen, NY. He had lots of second-hand stuff like iron nail trays--maybe still does. They work pretty well BTW.

Rick, I think i posted one some time ago,but can't remember the thread,so here is a picture.

Last year I was able to buy replacement impression wheels from Pilgrim for my machine (same as shown above). They fit perfectly.

I hope every one who is interested in shoes will look at this series of photos of Anthony Delos. Very informative.

It starts with some artsy photos in black and white and them gets into a series of colour photos and closups.

Enjoy

http://tinyurl.com/yh777yf

Tight Stitches
DWFII--HCC Member

DW,

Thanks for sharing those photos with us,I noticed a different way of insole preparation for the heel seat whip stitch than the way i do it,which i think might be stronger seam than the one done with a hold-fast as Hasluck suggested.

As a left hand shoe maker,it was nice to see the stitcher in the photos is also a left handed,which puts him in his right mind.

Regards
Nasser

Nasser,

Do you remember what photo that was...what number?

Tight Stitches
DWFII--HCC Member

DW,

It starts from photo 54 and few more after,it appears that Mr Delos doesn't remove any leather in heel seat area from the insole feather,It is also interesting to see how far in he cut his hold-fast in the waist(middle)which i think will produce a well fit in shoes,not to mention elegance.

Regards
Nasser