One "Last" Question

[kemosabi]

Paul,

I would go with the shoe last, since sliding the back of the heel past the counter will not be a problem when you can open the laces and it will fit the heel better too.
That's just my opinion though... for what it's worth.

What is 4 square? I'm always on the lookout for new sources of lasts.

Regards,
-Nat

[luckyduck]

Thanks for the input. I have not tried thier shoe last, but have heard good things about it.


4 square is Terry and Ephriam Glick out of Waco Texas. The web page is www.bootlast.com

Paul

[kemosabi]

Nice! Hadn't heard of these guys before.

Thx, -Nat

[last_maker]

Hey, yall,

I got my new issue of Shop Notes for wood working in the mail today and found a nifty tool I thought you guys might want to use/make. They are calling it in this periodical a multi-Wheel Sharpening station, However, there is no reason why this concept ( they way they put it together) couldn't be an inline finisher so I thought i would share. I thought also, i would set one up for polishing lasts.

here is the link. I hope it helps anyone:

http://www.shopnotes.com/issues/119/

This months issue isn't all that much $$ and the magizine goes into grave detail of step by step how to make one of these with a standard motor turning an arbor. The electrical wiring is simply adding a plug to the motor and the "arbor" is an elogated screw stick that you can get at your local home depot. finising Wheels are secured with nuts.

[courtney]

I want to have my lasts duplicated, has anyone had single pairs copied? I saw on the 4squared website it looks like they may do this, I'm nervous to send my lasts away. Do they usually have to destroy the originals? any help appreciated.

If in the worst case scenario I have to do this myself with plaster and smooth on, do I need to wrap the lasts with plastic wrap or something to keep them from getting all filled with plaster or could I just use the impression from the clay without the last?

Thanks,
Courtney

[sorrell]

Courtney,
I just had 4square duplicate a last for me and was quite pleased. They did have to rough up the surface of the last a little, but it's still usable and in good condition and I got it back without too much wait.

Lisa

[last_maker]

Courtney if you need a last, it is much simpler to get someone who does it all the time, like 4square to do it for you.

If you want to duplicate it your self, you will want to use some mold soap on the last and let it dry. Use a few layers. this will act like a mould release. It is best to make a three part mould. A bottom mould and two sides. I think I send you instructions for last mould making last year. do you still have it???

If you can't find it,

Use water clay and block both sides
with a 1 inch flange all the way around., leaving the sole side up and exposed.

make sure the mould soap is brushed on and is dry.

then place coddle boards with clamps. around your clay block high enough to cover the sole of your last by 1".

Pour your plaster. Let dry.

turn your mould to it's side. brush on mold soap on the plaster and the last.let dry apply three layers coddle board it up ( see utube for use of coddle boards) and pour plaster.

repeat for the other side.

Use kast a por. for your plastic lasts. You can order it onlne from Seattle Pottery.

Anyway, I still recomend, if you have the resources to have a company who knows, to duplicate your lasts for you.

-Marlietta
Lastmakingschool.com

[courtney]

Thanks Lisa, & Marlietta.

I may have found someone close so I dont have to send them away!

Courtney

[courtney]

Help! I cant get my lasts out,I cant get the lasts to break. theres no pegs, they're welted and have big build ups around the heel for the orthotics. Also I wet lasted them.

I had this happen before and ruined the boot, then last pair was okay( I used a suede split ) maybe the suede had more give?

Can anyone help me?

(Message edited by courtney on November 03, 2011)

[romango]

Courtney,

What have you tried so far? Do your lasts have a hole in the bask where a hook may be inserted?

- Rick

[courtney]

Oh my god! I got them off, I am sure I will be paying for that.

I will post pictures of the lasts later after I recover, maybe someone can provide insight into what might make it easier next time.

Thanks Rick.

Courtney

[artzend]

Courtney

First of all, you need to powder your lasts well before lasting.

#2 It sounds as though the heels were the problem and if so, tack the buildups on there, don't glue them to the lasts, then lever them away from the last before pulling it out. That is shoe tacks, not nails.

#3 If the forepart is stuck you can hammer the sole which quite often loosens it enough to get it moving. You may need to hammer the upper too, but put a piece of heavy leather over the upper before hammering.

Tim
www.shoemakingbook.com

[sorrell]

Courtney,
Been there, done that. One word of advice: chiropractor.

Lisa

[courtney]

Thanks Tim & Lisa,

Tim, I was kind of anticipating this and used lots of talc.

should I just saw off the sides of the heels and then put a couple tacks straight in? I would guess they should be pretty short, is'nt it hard to lever them off inside?

I want to duplicate this lasts since they fit pretty good finally and are almost all leather,
Do you think cutting off the sides of the heels would work the same, I would guess it would?

Courtney

[artzend]

Courtney

Don't saw anything off your lasts. Post photos. Yes I would put tacks straight in and it takes only a little levering to loosen them and allow the last to pull out.

Tim

[courtney]

14112.jpg

14113.jpg

14114.jpg

hopefully these pictures will help.
There is at least 1/4" of leather all around the heel, its hard to see whats going on because there is leather on the bottom too, the lasts fit my orthotics and my foot though.

Thanks,
Courtney

[dw]

Courtney,

I don't think the problems you had are directly related to the build ups on the heel.

I have had similar problems with spring hinged lasts with no build up.

If the topline is tight, it will always be smaller around than the base of the heel...and the heel is actually bigger around a half inch or so above the featherline. In fact, if you measure to a predetermined line on both sides of the heel the topline can be more than an inch smaller than the widest part of the heel.

What's more, the rearmost point on the last is actually further back than any point above it.

Now...If the lasts are spring hinged lasts, when you "break" the lasts, you are forcing the widest part of the heel (and the rearmost point on the back of the heel, into a decreasingly smaller dimension both horizontally and vertically.

Effectively the last actually gets longer.

Spring hinged lasts are great for boots, and to some extent, high top shoes. But while it can be done, it will destroy an old man's back (don't ask me how I know this) to try to pull such a last out of a shoe.

The better solution is a last with a different "hinge." The SAS hinge...if I recall the nomenclature correctly...is the one I use for shoes. This hinge actually causes the last to get shorter as the last is broken. And it is an old style last--In the back of Thornton are advertisements showing that style of last...almost, if not entirely, to the exclusion of spring hinge lasts.

In your case, you have three things working against you-- a spring hinged last, a narrow "comb" and a wide heel. I am surprised you got the lasts out without tearing the topline at the heel.

Well, that's my

Tight Stitches
DWFII--HCC Member

[center]Little Jack Dandiprat in a white petticoat,
The longer he lives, the shorter he grows.[/center]

[courtney]

Thanks D.W., They actually are chukka boots, does that change what you said? The sas last sounds better though.

I made the boots so they do clip in and are not straightened out at the back.

What do you think about my heel problems? The pair I made before seem alright, And the lasts are the same.

Courtney

(Message edited by courtney on November 04, 2011)

[artzend]

Courtney

Yes, that buildup will cause the problem you had. The only way that I know to sort it is to remove the buildup and use tacks to put it back in place, so it can be broken away from the last when pulling it out of the shoe.

The buildups can be removed from inside the shoe later. The tacks are soft and will bend easily, making removal of the last easy. Nails would hold too well and probably go into the last too far.

Tim

[courtney]

Uh oh, the two masters say different stuff.

thats okay though more to think about,

Tim, you can see the build ups are pretty extensive so wouldnt I kind of have to just make a straight cut with a band saw or something?

D.W., is this the last?

14119.jpg

[artzend]

Courtney

It's only leather, just use your knife. You have to be able to remove the leather buildup before you can get the last out. Otherwise you will continue to have the same problem over again. I had quite a few of these sort of buildups to deal with at one time.

Either that or cut the sides off your orthoses so that they are more like the last size. I am not sure that they need to be that wide anyway, but that is just something that I have wondered about.

If your foot fits into the bottom of a shoe made on that last, why does the orthotic have to be wider? Maybe someone else can say.

Tim

[dw]

Courtney,

I don't think there's any contradiction here. Tim's method is perhaps one way. I've never considered doing it that way but it would probably work.

The right kind of last is, in my opinion, a more universal solution and one that I am confident would work regardless of the build up.

And while the last depicted above is not exactly the same, the principle is the same. The lasts I have are made with a "trigger." Or you could call it a hinge lock. Either way it must be moved or tripped before the last will "break."

I suspect the above last is spring activated. If the spring is robust enough, it will be more than adequate I am sure.

In any case, as is evident in the photo the heel will move up and towards the toe as the last is broken. I think it is clear that even with a build up such as you are using on your last, the oblique tension that is now preventing the removal of the last would be eliminated.

Tight Stitches
DWFII--HCC Member

[center]Little Jack Dandiprat in a white petticoat,
The longer he lives, the shorter he grows.[/center]

[courtney]

D.W., are your lasts the speed-e slip ses lasts from jones and vining?

[jesselee]

Where can I send models of my personal last style to be turned in wood? Is this expensive? I have a 7 to 12 range.
Although I don't like modernization of any kind, if I was to cast copies of the lasts myself is there a resin compound that accepts hammering and the pokes of a pegging awl?

JesseLee

[dw]

Courtney,

I believe that's correct. I can't remember...I've got it written down somewhere...it's either SAS or SES, probably the latter.

When I sent my models to Jones and Vining I specified that they use that hinge for those models--all of which are shoe lasts.

Tight Stitches
DWFII--HCC Member

[center]Little Jack Dandiprat in a white petticoat,
The longer he lives, the shorter he grows.[/center]