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[admin]

Jan P Meyer,

Please take the second half of this conversation offline. Because the Honourable Cordwainers' Company is a 501C non-profit educational organization, business transactions involving quotes of prices, etc. may not take place on the Crispin Colloquy.

You may quote the prices of other companies or people...and you may see this being done on occasion here. But you may *not* quote prices in the context of a business transaction involving yourself...most especially if it involves profit.

If this policy is not clear...the best idea would be to refrain from quoting prices or negotiating business deals altogether.

Emmett

[gaid]

Jan P,

I'm glad to hear that Gutmann have found a new Juchten tanner. Last time I bought from them they just had some left-overs from the Swiss tanner who no more is in business. Please let us kow what you think about it. Btw, here is the e-mail address to the company; info@Leder-Gutmann.de

I will send you a mail off line about the kangaroo skinns.

JEM

[das]

Swedish Pitch--

This just in: very nice, very soft, aromatic pine-pitch from Auson A-B in Sweden, smells almost "right" [like the Burgundy pitch I favored until that source dried-up], and probably will need little if any softener, like oil, beeswax, or tallow, in the American Summer. Just add a bit of rosin, and off you go.

Auson A-B
Reningsverksgatan 10
SE-421 47 Vastra Frolunda
Sweden

monica.skytt@auson.se

+46 (0) 31 12 44 95 phone

+46 (0) 31 12 44 90 phone

+46 (0) 31 14 17 77 fax

The stuff I got was called "Auson-Beck 505" with an additional part #, 64100901.

It was a bargin at $6.99 [USD] per kilo., plus shipping.

About the best quality I've seen for making shoemakers' wax, and I've been getting samples of Swedish pitch, Burgundy pitch, etc. all winter trying for a new source.

BTW, Monica is very nice, and does fine with English. But ask for leak-proof containers if you live someplace warm. Mine had oozed out of the paper wrappers.

[sorrell]

I received a box full of old, holey, ripped-off soles this week. I called the guy who wanted them to let him know that I had a box full for him. He came up and got them today. He was very excited because they're just what he wanted and he happily reimbursed me for postage. He wants more though, so if anyone else is saving old soles for me you can send them to me and be assured that I'll send you a check for postage and this guy will be happy and reimburse me.

Lisa

[davidw]

To All,

I went to the Home Depot yesterday, and was looking at the different glues. On the shelf was the DAP Weldwood Contact Cement (red can) that's been around forever. Next to it was their new, water based, neoprene rubber version (DAP Weldwood Nonflammable Contact Cement [green can]). This sounded a lot like the Upaco cement some of you are now using. It even lists leather on the front of the can as one of its uses.

To make a long story short, I bought a quart for eight bucks and took it home. (They also have it in gallons.) This stuff is great! I've long been looking for something to replace Barge as a base for the "goop soles" (cement mixed with ground rubber) on my moccasins. This product has properties that make it even better than barge for this purpose. My initial experiments proved very good. I was worried about the waterproofness of a water based product. I had glued two pieces of leather together which had cured only 12 hours. I let this soak in water over night. The cement turned white (from peach), but I couldn't pull the two pieces apart no matter how hard I tugged.

Anyhow, I thought I'd let you all know about this product. Of course I don't know how it compares to the Upaco. But it is easily available in small quantities so you to experiment with it if you want to. Thanks to DW and others for seeking out an alternative and putting the words "water based neoprene" in my head. We also have to thank those pesky environmentalists for forcing these technological breakthroughs on us!

[dw]

David,

That's good to know. I did a little buyer's consortium with the Upaco and even though I was scrupulous about passing on only what I was charged (didn't even add for the hassle of running to the post office), a gallon of the Upaco came to near $50.00, what with the shipping to me, the sipping to a third party and the extra one gallon buckets that I had to divide the five gallon minimum order into.

Truth to tell, although I like the water based neoprene, it wasn't a good experience for any of us who got in on that order. And $50.00 a gallon makes it "white gold"...as some wag put it.

Tight Stitches
DWFII--Member HCC

[Mike Strong]

Hi All,

Does anyone know where to find a instructional or owners manuel for an Landis American Straight needle stitcher. I just pickup one for my new shop. So I need to know how to adjust the threads and things like the needle. Thanks.

Mike

[jake]

Mike,

Give Pilgrim a call at 1-800-343-2202.

Adios, Jake

[marc]

This may be off topic, and if so I apologize.

I've received a question from a Lady in the Seattle WA area who is looking for someone who would be willing to teach her to make a pair of 15th-16th century shoes (Italian). She is not looking for a supplier, but someone who can get her started. If any of you are in that area, please contact the lady (lorijaneleppink at yahoo dot com)

Marc

[dw]

I just received an email from an HCC member (Denise Lomus) who said she had just got off the phone with Barnsley. They told her that they had ceased production as of the end of December 2003. And that the company had not been sold to anyone else...just going toes up!

Anyone have any confirmation...and/or further information on this turn of events--"what a revolting development this is!"

Tight Stitches
DWFII--Member HCC

[jake]

D.W.,

It wouldn't surprise me. I usually get a calendar from them every year....not one this time.

Sure hate it...if it's true.

[jake]

D.W.,

It true.....

[dw]

Jake,

How did you get confirmation? Did you call them?

What I hate the most about them closing is that there's no one producing a decent bulldog anywhere in the world...as far as I know. And as far as curved--sewing and inseaming--awls there's no one in the world who has been producing decent awls for as long as I can remember...but Barnsley's were probably the best...that you could get reliably, that is. So I'll miss both of those things.

Frankly, I think that Barnsley going under is a blow to the Trade that we will all regret and that we will not soon, if ever, see a source to replace them. It's gonna get tough(er) for a newbie to get into this biz by a great deal. Damn! It troubles me.

Goetz can pick up some of the slack on most of the hand tools but who else is there? Anyone know? have any Ideas?

I'm in the market for curved sewing awls...especially older ones...and especially at two and a half to three and a half inches. Anyone reading this who has more than they need or has run across some in an antique shop or from a tool dealer...let me know--I'll buy them (if they are suitable) and make it very worth your while.

And if anyone knows where you can buy decent bulldog pincers....well, now I'm dreamin'

Tight Stitches
DWFII--Member HCC

[jake]

Dee-Dubb,

Got it from a feller who talked directly to Andrew Barnsley.

Been cutting wood all day and thinking about this situation. It scares me to death! Just makes me sick. I hope someone will step up to the plate and provide the world with a much needed service. I say, "much needed", maybe it ain't. Just because it's important to us, doesn't mean the world is listening. With most of the people wearing factory made footwear, we may be a dying breed. Anyone remember the movie "Montie Walsh"? It's about the declining need for cowboys.

Hate to sound like a pessimist, because most of the time I'm pretty optimistic. But with the declining availability of good leather, just one last company worth mentioning in the U.S., and now our most important provider of hand tools and grindery products closing, it doesn't look very promising for newbies.

On the brighter side, Wild Bill will make a fortune this year. Good for You Wild Bill!

Larry, that old chest just got more valuable.

[Mike Strong]

D.W.

I've been doing some thinking about this. What about asking Ron if he would make awls for us. I'm sure he could make something really close to what we need. Just some food for you to chew on.
Or maybe I'm thinking too much.
Mike

[dw]

Mike,

From what I understand, Ron has more or less turned the business over to someone else to run...he just rakes in the profits. But I'm not sure he has ever done anything similar to making awls, in any case. I'm just guessing but I would have to say that most of what he does is machine work. Those awls dern near need to be hand forged. I don't think they can simply be cast. Same thing goes for some of the other tools, like the bulldogs. They must be cast to begin with but I've got a a sneaking suspicion that something else must be done to them to make them stand up to the gaff of heavy use. I broke a pair of Barnsley's hammering on the jaws. Had to have it replaced by an old navy blacksmith, who simply re-forged a replacement jaw. He told me the original was cast and wouldn't take welding very well.

Dick Anderson has made some awls. He may even be ready to try his hand at producing some for sale. The tempering is critical, though. And the price for a hand forged sewing awl may shock some back to jerk needles.

Through the grapevine I have it that Colin Barnsley, a brother of the present owner of Barnsley and Sons, owns and operates a separate company that's carrying some awls, hammers, and knives that are virtually identical or from the same sources as those items that Geo. Barnsley and Sons was carrying.

The address is:

Woodware Repetitions Ltd.
47 Mowbray Street
Sheffield S3 8EN
England

One other thing about the bulldogs...USM is still making bulldogs as far as I know. They have plastic handles, and are far larger and, because of the way they are shaped, less functional to my way of thinking than the Barnsleys...or the old pair of Christiansons, that I have (thanks to Lisa Sorrel).

Tight Stitches
DWFII--Member HCC

[mnewberry]

All,

I have a customer who would like a pair of sahrkskin boots, but doesn't like the softer, matte finish shark that I've usually gotten from Garlin Neumann Leather. Rather, he wants the thinner, more surface-finished type. I've never used it, always assuming that it was the lesser product, but since I've heard from some customers that it wears great. Does anyone have an opinion to share about shark, and better still, a supplier to recommend for this type? (I've checked with John Fong, Sun City and a couple of others, but no luck.) Thanks,

Matt

[dw]

Matt,

I have used shark for many years...starting with stuff I got from John G. Mahler (are they still in business?) to some "sand shark" I got from Ocean Leather way back when, and all I can say is that the stuff I got from Garlin was the worst of all of it--not to blame Garlin...the tannages have changed to suit the Japanese.

I hate shark. It will stretch forever. And unless it is in a solid dark colour in the old "hard finish" it will flatten out during crimping and lasting and just look like painted leather. If you start out with a peanut brittle that has had the high spots "tipped" or dyed a darker colour, what you end up with is a smooth toe (no texture or ridges whatsoever) with dark blotches painted on the peanut brittle. Yu-u--ck!

It wears OK, I guess...not any better than oliphaunt, though.

Tight Stitches
DWFII--Member HCC

[sorrell]

Does anyone know a source for the plastic glue pots that hold the brush in about 1/2" of glue and have the "dunce cap" lids that fit over the brush? The pots are clear and the "dunce cap" thing on the ones I have are blue.

I called Konomos last week and attempted to order some. The guy I spoke with was extremely rude and unhelpful but he assured me he knew exactly what I was talking about and yes, he had them. Then he sent me the jars with screw-on lids.

I've attempted to order them from O. Baltor before. I KNOW they have them--that's where I got mine. I've called them twice, spoken with a real person, placed an order and then...nothing. I never receive anything and when I call they've never heard of me.

Do I sound frustrated?

Lisa

[relferink]

Lisa,

Sounds like you are looking for what I know to be a T-boy glue dispencer. Different companies give it different names. just to make sure is this what you are looking for?

2759.jpg

I've gotten them from Frankford leather in Philly. Also carried by Altas out of california.
No you don't sound frustrated. I'm the same way once I find something that works well for me don't change it on me.

Rob

[dw]

McPhersons in Seattle (used to be Arensberg). They're called Tboys. Three sizes

Tight Stitches
DWFII--Member HCC

http://www.bootmaker.com

[erickgeer]

I have bought them from Ohio Travel Bag, they come in small and large sizes, but they have a minimum order req.
My local supplier used to sell them, but switched to the screw top ones.

Erick Geer Wilcox

[sorrell]

Rob, D.W. and Erick,
Thanks guys! With three places to choose from, I should be able to order myself a glue pot now!

Lisa

[dw]

McPhersons...1.800.343.9949 ask for Greg

[erickgeer]

I wasn't sure where to post this, so here goes:

I spoke to Colin Barnsley at Woodwares Repetitions Ltd., to see if they are still working on a catalog of the remaining inventory of George Barnsley and Sons - they are.

I asked him about the Bulldog Pincers, but he could not locate(?) at least a sample to reproduce from. His request was, if someone could donate an old pair either to examine or disassemble, he might be able to reproduce a limited quantity.
Below is the contact info, with a complete number to dial from the states.

Colin Barnsley
Woodware Repetitions Ltd.
47 Mowbray Street
Sheffield S3 8EN
England
T: 011+44+114+272-6060

This could be very cool, he was very interested in this on the telephone.

On a similar note - does anyone know of a source for a Goetz catalog? Macpherson doesn't seem to have them.

Thanks,
Erick Geer Wilcox