Shoe machines

[dearbone]

As most of you know,i am a hand shoe maker, a sewing machine for uppers and sometimes a finisher,so i had this trimming machine sitting in the shop for 15 or more years until recently i put a motor on it and now it is trimming well, in leather and rubber,but since i bought it used,i wonder if any one has seen one or any idea how old it might be?

8986.jpg

Nasser

[jesselee]

Nasser,
Mine is similar and is driven by a wide leather belt and is around the first years of the 1900's before WWI. I think you are looking at 1910-1930. In the 30's and 40's they started encasing these trimmers on the end of line finishers. All these small ones are pre 30's by what I have seen.

Cheers,
JesseLee

[dearbone]

Jesse Lee,

Thank you my friend,mine had a wide pulley driven by leather belt,but i couldn't find a similar width pulley for the motor side,but i easily found the one on it,and it is secure and it would not slides to sides like the leather belts sometimes do, but i like the old wide pulley myself.

Nasser

[jesselee]

Nasser,
Mine is wider and more square, but is arranged the same way. I am missing the cutter stone. I had another one which was just one shaft, it was very old.
I actually hardly ever use the trimmers. On my Progressive there is one right on the shaft at the end, inches from the outsole stitcher.
By habit I use the small sanding wheel with the metal sides for all sole and heel work, or do it all by hand.
Did you ever get your old timey sighn out?
JesseLee

[dearbone]

Ron,

I think the 5 by 1 questions fall under shoe machines,but anyway if you Google "5 by 1 leather cutter", there are some good pictures of the machine.

Nasser

[chuck_deats]

Nassar, Not many machines look scarey to me, but the thing on the right hand side of that machine looks vicious and dangerous, sort of like an exposed saw blade. What is it used for and should there not be some sort of guard on it?

[dearbone]

Chuck,

Thank you for your concern, you should see how exposed my old finisher is,i am very careful when operating machinery, the thing on the right is the sharpening stone for the cutters,i agree there should be a guard there and i will think of making something to cover it.

[dearbone]

Jesse Lee,

The sign is still inside behind glass front wall of the shop and i will hang it in the new shop hopefully,I am looking for a bigger shop or a house.

Nasser

[chuck_deats]

Nasser, I feel better. I like those old machines. If it is a stone, it will only take a little hide if you bump it. A cutter would take a finger or hand. It is none of my business but appreciate the reply.

[dearbone]

Chuck, years ago i worked in a fully mechanized boot and shoe shop and was shown how to use the trimmer in that shop,which makes mine looks like a toy,mine is an old one and i think it is a bad design having the two cutters so close to each other and having the sharpening stone exposed,but to assure you and myself,i will take out the stone and the bottom cutter which is for trimming rubber and i hardly use rubber for soling,the sole cutter might be useful for rounding curves for better hand finish.

[jesselee]

Nasser,

The sign is a brilliant idea. Maybe it will start a tradition with some of us using old timey signs. As to taking the bottom cutter off, good call, replace it with a burnishing wheel. Thats what I have. I have lots of cutters and burnishing wheels, all rusty and need resharpened and re dressed.

Chuck

My old finisher is totally exposed. Never had one with the wheel covers or fan hooked up. Had a few wheels explode on me as well as sand strips. So it may be time to fashion something up.

Cheers,

JesseLee

[dearbone]

Jesse Lee,

The inspiration or the idea for the sign came from Paul Lacroix, Paris 1852 book which contains very interesting signs, fine cloth Banners with all sort of tools of trade and animals embroidered on them and many more trade goodies,i will scan some pages and will post them somewhere on the forum.

Nasser

[jesselee]

Nasser,

Excellent, I appreciate that old stuff. Always wanted an old timey sign.

JesseLee

[john_ralston]

I need a bit of help from those in the know.

I make Holsters and Belts, not shoes or boots, but I bought a finisher to aid in the dressing of the edges of my products (most higher production holster makers use them).

The edge of a holster or belt ends up being in the 14-16 oz. range, and the sole trimmer is used to clean it up, just like on a shoe. The trouble is....I don't have a clue how to use it! It is in a warehouse, and not from someone who makes leather goods, so they don't know anything about it either.

When I use the trimmer do I need to sand the edges first, or does the trimmer take care of everything? The sole trimmer is said to be "Adjustable" but I know nothing about them, so I don't know if they are incorrect in their statement or if it can be adjusted for different weights of leather.

The sole trimmer looks to be mounted a bit high for my liking, but I can build a platform in front. The dust collectiion hood will need to be cut back a tad as well I think, otherwise getting the edges of a belt trimmed will be a booger.

It is a Sutton/Landis 2000 (Per the ad) and looks like the Image in the next post.

Any help would be greatly appreciated.

John


BTW - I have no need for the Numakeg - If anyone has interest in it, let me know.

(Message edited by john ralston on May 03, 2009)

(Message edited by john ralston on May 03, 2009)

[john_ralston]

Lets try this for a Picture...

9480.jpg

[dearbone]

John,

If you have not use a sole trimmer,please try to find some one to show you first, the trimmers come in different width sizes and not very cheap and they need to be sharp and they are basically sixteen teeth(blades) running(turning) at very high speed,so smooth your edges well before using the trimmer because they don't like rough edges and the work or the operator can get seriously damaged, make light contact with trimmer and try not move your hands(work in your hands) right or left,for that will also change the angle.

Nasser

[dearbone]

On some finishing machines the trimmer is mounted so it can drop lower by a gear/device when in use and raised higher to get it out of the way so to speak when not in use.

Nasser

[john_ralston]

Thanks - I will have to find someone in the Portland, OR area to show me how it is done. I see a lever on the right hand side of the cabinet, so maybe you pull that down and the trimmer follows. That could be what they meant by "Adjustable". I will know more one I pick it up I guess.

Where can I find other trimmers? Like I said, I need something for 14-16 oz.

Thanks for the info.

John

[dearbone]

You are welcome, a good shoe repair shop can help here,even if you have to pay for his/her half or an hour time, there is supplier in Canada,but i am sure you can find them in the US,there might be some cutters coming your with the machine, also look up sole cutters (USM), their cutters are sized in iron instead of oz.

Nasser

[paul]

John,

I'll input alittle here. I've used this model finisher for years. But I don't have one now.

Tha "adjustable" part, no doubt relates to the collar surrounding the edger blade. Turn it clockwise or counterwise to control the exposure of the trimmer blade. Nasser's description of it and his warnings are good.

I've seen and experienced some pretty serious accidents on the trimmer. Sharp Matters! But more than that there must not be a long tooth. It'll snag and drag you in there.

I'll also recommend looking for the sweet spot on the curvature of the edger, when you use it. For my height (I'm 6'1) it's about 7 o'clock. When I've gotten too close to 6 o'clock, and if I've got a longer tooth on the blade, I'll be all puckerd up in a flash, when the boot or shoe is yanked from my hands. or worse yet, I'm dragged into the monster. I've got scars to show for that one.

I'll add one more tip. Sand your edges as even and smooth as possible before trimming. (Keep the naumkeg, you'll wish you had.) The trim really is just for a final clean up, in my opinion.

One more thing, if I may. I'd be a little nervous about flappin' a belt around inside the area where all those belts and trimmers are moving at such a high rate of speed. You might want to rethink that part. Imagine the consequences of the inevitable.

Hope I don't offend.

Back to the bench,

Paul

[paul]

Actually,

I don't know if I can pinpoint a "sweet spot" on the trimmer. I may be misleading there.

It differes according to what and where you are trimming. For example trimming a toe, such as I was thinking of in my above post, for me it's really somewhere in the area of 4 o'clock to 7 o'clock, where I find myself using the trimmer. The point is to avoid the spot where it can be grabbed out of your hand.

All that really relates to footwear, and not belts, and, like all of this stuff, it's a matter of practice.

However I will stay with my warning about trying to trim belts on this machine.

Good luck,
Paul

[john_ralston]

The only reason I had mentioned doing the belt was that my late mentor did them that way


(Message edited by john ralston on May 04, 2009)

[john_ralston]

9482.jpg

Having trouble getting my picture posting syntax correct!

[dearbone]

I can't really see from the picture,whether it is a trimmer(cutter) or just a finishing cam like the ones below that he is using above,These cams? leave a very well burnished edges and they fit into one end of the shaft of my finishing machine,surprisingly not a speck of leather dust under the belt, on the tray or on his hands which are the usual features of a trimming machine, unless he has a very powerful vacuum, i personally would be afraid of using the trimmer for belts.
Nasser

9486.jpg

[john_ralston]

I was always told it was a trimmer, and that picture may have been take with everything turned off - I didn't take it.

Unfortunately he passed away a few months back, so I can't ask, and the machinery is on the east coast, so I can't go look for myself.

John

(Message edited by john ralston on May 05, 2009)