Bottoming techniques

[nickb1]

Does anyone know about Garat insoles and outsole bends, how they compare? I believe they are chestnut tanned, either 6 months or a year, depending what you buy. Insoles can be oiled or fatted (up to 14% for Norwegian), bends either half cylindrical or beaten (what is the difference?).

Don't know about Garat but came across Thomas Ware & sons recently in the UK. They also do chestnut pit-tanned outsoles, some of which are prepared for wet outdoor use: https://thomasware.co.uk/our-products/t ... e-leather/. It seems there are 3 pit tanneries left in the UK. I wonder what the 3rd one is? Claytons?

[carsten]

I have never been happy with filling the forepart of waist of shoes with granulated cork. If sheets are used they must be mounted with All-Purpose cement which is occlusive. And whether in sheet form or paste, it tends to be fugitive--eventually breaking up into crumbs which migrate out from under pressure points in the foreparts. So put off by that disintegration, I used leather for years. But again if not cemented in with AP (which is occlusive), it will cause the shoes to creak.

Searching for a solution, I tried wool felt. When mounted with paste this seems like an ideal solution. It will not break up, it moulds itself to the plantar contours of the foot and shoes don't creak.

Some years ago, @das sent me a couple of deconstructed 1930's(?) era West End shoes. I was particularly struck by the insole liner in both shoes. It was a tarred felt.

I experimented with trying to tar my felt with Stockholm Tar, Real Stuff, etc.. It never would 'dry up' and I just ended up with greasy felt.

And the 'tar paper' that is available on this side of the pond is just that--paper.

In any case, recently a fellow on another forum pointed out that the tarred felt I had seen on the vintage West End shoes was, in fact Irish Flax Felt aka shipbuilder's felt and available at Schooner Chandlery. And real felt, not paper.

A dab of HK here and there secures it and eventually the tar will meld with the fibers of the leather enough to affix it to the insole. My only reservation is that it is a little thin compared to the wool felt that I have been using. But I remember the vintage stuff being thin as well.

Irish felt2(1024_x_768).jpg

irish felt(1024_x_768).jpg

You are talking about shoes from 1930:


Just found this silent movie from 1930:

And though it might be interesting for the forum.

See at: 8:19 :

Not sure what he is using. It does not look like HK nor like cement but quite sticky.

Because of the colour it looks to me like he had used tar/pitch(?) to stick a leather piece for filling the forepart of the shoe.

Seems like he takes the stuff out of an unheated pot - or maybe it was heated before in an oven???. I wonder how / if it dried and what the benefits were over using cement in his case.

The outsole on the other hand appears to be cemented. See: 09:03 and the heel was maybe assembled using a past see 10:55.

[carsten]

Inspired by @nickb1 and after I had found out that Spenle is selling wooden soles I am presently making some clog-type sandals for my wife. The soles came sanded and I have treated the bottom and sides with shellac, which makes a nice an shiny finish. Now I wonder if I should treat the top surface as well or not? I think untreated the wood might absorb more moisture and will be more pleasant to walk on - but then the wood will probably develop stains over time. Can anyone tell how the traditional clogs were treated?

Thanks, Carsten

[nickb1]

Hi Carsten,
Mine are untreated and supposedly traditionally made, though the original leather is long since demised ("waxed kip"). I don't see why they would have been treated inside. It gets dirty over time but so does leather. Having said that for sandals often a finished insole is used (e.g. using bridle leather) because it looks nicer / doesn't absorb the dirt as much. Clogs weren't sandals back in the day, they were used more as work boots particularly in wet environments.
Nick

[carsten]

Thanks @nickb1 .

[Amasiah]

Hi I am looking into making my first real leather outsole (instead of vibram) and the information I find about how to dye and iron etc are useful but seems somewhat incomplete so I don't really want to get into it unless I have confidence that I actually really know what I'm doing and if I have all the materials... can someone directs me in this process?
i am still learning how to sew the welt by hand without issues but starting to figure it out, it seems like even in this process there are different methods, but I manages to make something that looks somewhat decent with stormwelt.