Hello all -
Reviving this thread - I have a Civil War era adjustable boot pattern and had a question about measurement markings -
The front and back pattern are marked with what appears to be size markings, 1 - 11.
The castor pattern is curious though, the has two scales, one just above the break, and one about an inch up. The bottom scale is marked "C" with a scale with numbers 10-15, and the scale slightly above is marked "F" with the same scale. The portion that adjusts length of the lasting allowance is marked with a single scale, 8-11.
Here is a picture for reference:
https://imgur.com/a/nxHhytJ
Any idea how to use a pattern with these numbers? It is mainly the castor pattern I am puzzled about.
Civil War Shoemaking
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das
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Re: Civil War Shoemaking
First step, inspect the pattern pieces carefully for a patent-holder's name and date. Then search his patent (US Patent Office has on-line search resource). The number scales on these things are "pattern" sizes, not shoe sizes, or inches, etc. Unless you can get the patent description to how those particular patentee's scales are to be used, it's kinda like messing with a combination lock for which you don't know the combination. Good luck!
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dw
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Re: Civil War Shoemaking
FWIW, not every maker used those patterns.
You can learn a lot from them if you're just starting out but I've been making full wellingtons for many decades and I've never had a set of patterns. I wanted a set just for the collector's value but never really needed them.
You can learn a lot from them if you're just starting out but I've been making full wellingtons for many decades and I've never had a set of patterns. I wanted a set just for the collector's value but never really needed them.
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And without the recognition that there is a hierarchy of excellence in all things, nothing rises above the level of mundane.
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das
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Re: Civil War Shoemaking
They served their purpose in their day, for the contractors mass-producing plain Jane boots and bootees for the US Army. Though I've seen fancy brass ones dated into the 1880s, I think their use for bespoke-grade boots was probably minimal.
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bfeito
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Re: Civil War Shoemaking
Thanks gents - I have scoured the patterns for manufacture and patent dates but have had no luck with locating them. There are some rough spots that may have something underneath which I am not seeing. When interpreting the numbers on the upper patterns as size, I find the upper patterns to be spot on when comparing to other patterns I have of a known and proven size, but the castor pattern remains a mystery. I'll continue the investigation, but the combination lock analogy seems spot on. Luckily I have some boots made by other keepers of the knowledge on this forum that have been an invaluable tool for dimensional comparison.
They have proven to be a great guide for this beginner, but as DW suggests, It seems the real secret to boot making is understanding how to apply custom measurements to generate precise patterns. I am fully aware that I am just scratching the surface of a master craft.
DAS - I dug up a comment you made previously regarding the tendency of these patterns to be engineered for very little wastage....spot on. When cut to the base pattern, there is very little room for inconsistency with how the boots are stretching during the crimping process. I have learned to add a little bit of safety allowance since leather is a less expensive commodity then my time and frustration at this point.
They have proven to be a great guide for this beginner, but as DW suggests, It seems the real secret to boot making is understanding how to apply custom measurements to generate precise patterns. I am fully aware that I am just scratching the surface of a master craft.
DAS - I dug up a comment you made previously regarding the tendency of these patterns to be engineered for very little wastage....spot on. When cut to the base pattern, there is very little room for inconsistency with how the boots are stretching during the crimping process. I have learned to add a little bit of safety allowance since leather is a less expensive commodity then my time and frustration at this point.
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Billw12280
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Re: Civil War Shoemaking
Hello all,
I found this forum while trying to research some footwear that I recently acquired. It is difficult to find information on the construction of 19th century footwear, specifically Civil War era, so I was elated when I found this site. I have 3 pairs of brogans, one "minty" Civil War era pair, a second pair that I bought at auction as Civil War era but I believe them to be 1882/1885 campaign shoes and a third pair that I am not sure about authenticity on (I have been told that due to the size and lack of stiffness they appear to be reenactors shoes). This last pair certainly "feels" old to me, but how old? I also have a knee high pair of boots that I cannot decide if they are Civil War or post Civil War.
In reading through this thread I realized I don't know much about shoe construction but I would like to learn. What are the differences between a lock stitch and a chain stitch? What can I look for that would indicate if a shoe was constructed during the Civil War? Is there a way to determine who manufactured a shoe based on construction technics?
I hope this is the appropriate venue to post pictures and ask questions pertaining to my shoes. The following images are for the pair of brogans that authenticity has been questioned on due to the construction, the size, and the fact that "they do not appear to have the requisite stiffness of an antique". The soles are nailed on instead of pegged or stitched, the soles appear to have been repaired, could this be why they are nailed instead of pegged or sewn? The shoes measure approximately 12" from heel to toe, and the vamp is a 2 piece construction instead of the normal one piece. I believe there was a pair pictured in the Time Life series Echoes of Glory that had a two piece vamp. The caption on them stated they were a Federal variant. Is it possible that's what these are? I reached the limit for attaching photos but I can provide more pictures if needed.
These brogans look very similar to a pair that sold on Heritage Auctions several years ago.
https://historical.ha.com/itm/military- ... ion-071515
I cannot find any marking on the shoes. Is it possible they are authentic period shoes or just older reenactors shoes as has been suggested?
I found this forum while trying to research some footwear that I recently acquired. It is difficult to find information on the construction of 19th century footwear, specifically Civil War era, so I was elated when I found this site. I have 3 pairs of brogans, one "minty" Civil War era pair, a second pair that I bought at auction as Civil War era but I believe them to be 1882/1885 campaign shoes and a third pair that I am not sure about authenticity on (I have been told that due to the size and lack of stiffness they appear to be reenactors shoes). This last pair certainly "feels" old to me, but how old? I also have a knee high pair of boots that I cannot decide if they are Civil War or post Civil War.
In reading through this thread I realized I don't know much about shoe construction but I would like to learn. What are the differences between a lock stitch and a chain stitch? What can I look for that would indicate if a shoe was constructed during the Civil War? Is there a way to determine who manufactured a shoe based on construction technics?
I hope this is the appropriate venue to post pictures and ask questions pertaining to my shoes. The following images are for the pair of brogans that authenticity has been questioned on due to the construction, the size, and the fact that "they do not appear to have the requisite stiffness of an antique". The soles are nailed on instead of pegged or stitched, the soles appear to have been repaired, could this be why they are nailed instead of pegged or sewn? The shoes measure approximately 12" from heel to toe, and the vamp is a 2 piece construction instead of the normal one piece. I believe there was a pair pictured in the Time Life series Echoes of Glory that had a two piece vamp. The caption on them stated they were a Federal variant. Is it possible that's what these are? I reached the limit for attaching photos but I can provide more pictures if needed.
These brogans look very similar to a pair that sold on Heritage Auctions several years ago.
https://historical.ha.com/itm/military- ... ion-071515
I cannot find any marking on the shoes. Is it possible they are authentic period shoes or just older reenactors shoes as has been suggested?
You do not have the required permissions to view the files attached to this post.
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bfeito
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Re: Civil War Shoemaking
Gents - a pleasure as always.
Question here - I am proud to report that I successfully made a pair of boots from the patterns mentioned above that are up to standard and that for a first effort, I am relatively proud of them including the mistakes that I, or many of you, could identify.
I now am engaged in making a pair of boots for a friend in exchange for some original items he passed on to me. While the idea of making boots for others doesn't settle well, he is a good friend and I look forward to making another pair.
With this in mind, I have good measurements I can work with for this gentleman's foot. My lasts are in the neighborhood for the foot with some adjustment, but his calf is larger than my current patterns can accomodate to the tune of 2 inches. I have no problem modifying the pattern, but i could use some wisdom. When making a 2 piece wellington, what is the best way to add material to the calf area of the boot to make a larger calf measurement? The waist is good for his foot and should remain the same. Moving up the leg should I add material to the front of the boot exclusively, or to both the front and back pieces of the boot starting above the waist?
Advice and wisdom is much appreciated.
All the best,
B
Question here - I am proud to report that I successfully made a pair of boots from the patterns mentioned above that are up to standard and that for a first effort, I am relatively proud of them including the mistakes that I, or many of you, could identify.
I now am engaged in making a pair of boots for a friend in exchange for some original items he passed on to me. While the idea of making boots for others doesn't settle well, he is a good friend and I look forward to making another pair.
With this in mind, I have good measurements I can work with for this gentleman's foot. My lasts are in the neighborhood for the foot with some adjustment, but his calf is larger than my current patterns can accomodate to the tune of 2 inches. I have no problem modifying the pattern, but i could use some wisdom. When making a 2 piece wellington, what is the best way to add material to the calf area of the boot to make a larger calf measurement? The waist is good for his foot and should remain the same. Moving up the leg should I add material to the front of the boot exclusively, or to both the front and back pieces of the boot starting above the waist?
Advice and wisdom is much appreciated.
All the best,
B