Shoe machines

[Dan]

D.W., Erick, Jake,
Thanks for the helpful replies and counsel. I agree that it is wise to ask for the roller foot first, and then ask if it is ball bearing mounted.
I suspect the reply may be "how do I tell if it's
ball bearing or not"? D.W., if you could post a close up of a ball bearing foot and/or a description it may prove very helpful. I am going to undertake to find the source for these.
I have been researching replacement clutch motors, as the motor on my Juki 563 is going out. The hot set up for sewing machine motors these days is the servo motor, which apparently is making obsolete the old clutch type. The servo is virtually noiseless; does not run until the pedal is pressed. Has adjustable speed and adjustable sensitivity. There is a discussion at:

http://www.sewingworld.com/cgi-bin/bbcgi/ ultimatebb.cgi?ubb=get_topic&f=25&t=000293

You may have to copy and paste the entire URL
to get it to work.
I'm going to order one of these motors and will report back. The price I'm paying is less than the one referred in the Sewingworld forum.

Dan

[Dan]

Well, it appears the Sewingworld URL will not
co-operate.

If you go to Sewingworld.com, scroll down and click on the "Other Machines" tab, the discussion on servo motors is there.

Dan

[dw]

Dan,

The roller foot with the ball bearings doesn't look a heck of a lot different than the one without. Maybe a little deeper from where the roller foot connects to the presserfoot shaft--to accommodate the extra room needed to house the bearings. But it turns a hundred percent better. If you get the type without, you'll always be "in-between." In-between tightening the rollerfoot itself too tight to the presser foot shaft--which means it won't turn freely--and too loose--which makes it wobble and be inaccurate.

Those new type motors and clutch assembly sounds real slick, especially if you can control the speed. But I've replaced motors about every five years (or more) on my machines and never soent more than $20.00 total. This last time I spent the $20 and got a new cradle too.

I recently bought a new motor for my finisher and spent over $300.00.

Just a thought...

BTW, you might also contact industrialsewingmaching.com

Tight Stitches
DWFII--HCC Member

[tomo]

Hey Dan,
Sorry to hear your motors 'sucked a kumara.' The servo motors are quite common in the rag trade. Apart from the noise factor, there's a saving on electricity too, 'cause the machine only draws current while it's actually sewing. So if you had a factory with say 50 machinists, the savings would soon add up.
More power to y'awl (...should probably change awl to motor!!)
T.

[Dan]

D.W.,
Per your suggestion I spoke with Arnold Kay of Melanie Machine this morning. He is very knowledgeable and understood immediately when I asked about the roller bearing foot for the 31-15.
There are two different styles of this foot.
One flips up and out of the way.
The other turns to the left and out of the way.
He needs to know which one, and the required size of the roller.
If you can give me this information, I will report back on cost and time for delivery for anyone who would like to try one.
Thanks,
Dan

[dw]

Dan,

The one's I've used all flip up and out of the way. I've never seen one for the 31 class machine that rotates out of the way to the left --although I have seen that type for post machines.

There are two sizes, however. One where the roller itself is about the size of a nickel and the other about the size of a quarter. If you've only got one machine, get the larger one.

Tight Stitches
DWFII--Member HCC

[Dan]

Price of the roller bearing mounted roller presser foot is $35. Shipping is $5.00 Availability is 1-2 days.
Melanie Machine is not set up for credit cards.
Happy to ship COD, or send money order to Arnold's attention.
I ordered one with quarter sized foot.
Arnold asked if I would advise everyone that he has, or can get, any type of leather related machine, parts, etc.

Dan

[shoestring]

Dan,
where is Arnold's located and do you have contact info for them.
Ed

[Dan]

Ed,

Arnold Kay
Melanie Machine
4371 E 49th St
Vernon, CA 90058

800.894.9268
(323) 586-2090
fax (323) 586-2097

Thanks to DW for this contact!

[das]

Speaking of roller feet...

Anybody have any suggestions on where to find the roller foot w/ assembly for a Singer 45K70 cylinder-arm harness machine?

According to the Singer manuals webpage, the 45K63 and the 45K25 versions had roller feet, but no parts numbers were listed. The 45Ks all look to be the same basic machine, so I'm hoping a foot assembly off a 63 or a 25 will fit right into my 70. Or am I dreamin'?

I'm also looking for a Singer 11-17 cylinder arm that sews up the arm for back-strapping boots, if anybody has any leads.

[j milne]

Sewinmg Machines to sell I pick them up at verious auctions ...and I don't know how to sew.
A couple old black industrial sewing machines one with horizontal post and work table. a gray singer with benz motor and work table 2 frabanco shoe leather crank machines a juki serger mo 3004 motor and work table and a pfaff with motor and table ... all are to my knowledge in good working order one of the frobana's is missing what i think would be called its bobbin. I am in Ontario Canada half way between detroit and london and the machines are in london petrolia and walaceburg because i keep storage in different places.

[Dan]

To update on the ball bearing mounted roller presser foot:
Received the part today from Melanie Machine.
It is definitely a quality piece and looks like it would last a couple of lifetimes.
Did I resist taking it apart to verify the existence of the ball bearings?
Of course not.
Yep. Ball bearings all present and accounted for.
Roller is exactly the size of a nickel, and turns
smoothly with no play.
Very pleased with the part and the prompt and friendly service from Mr. Kay.
Now I am thinking of sending it off to Bob Booth to be narrowed...

Dan

[cmw]

Tom

I talked to my boss. He said that the new name for pedersen is scansteel. Sure enough it was true.

http://www.pedersen-spares.com/

he is going to look at some of the old manuels that he has. Doen't hold your breath, it could take a while IF he has it.

We have a 5 in 1 cutter that is an old Wilh.(wilhelm) Pedersen. It also has "Høng, Danmark" on the same serial nr. plate.

I hope this helps and I'll let you know if he finds a manuel.


Still playin catch-up
CW

[cmw]

Now it's my turn.

Jakob, my boss, was given a singer 34z11 post machine today. It looks like an old saddle makers machine. What do ya'll think?

CW

[tomo]

Chris,
Thanks for your help, tried the site you first suggested, but couldn't read it - English and American are the only foreign languages I know!!

Contacted Pedersen as a result of your efforts and got a reply by the next morning. They no longer have any manuals, but they still have the drawings of the finishers and can make parts if needed.

I also gave them the serial number of my machine and Pedersens were able to tell me that it came to NZ in 1964 and was sold to a firm in Christchurch.

Now about your post machine. I've never heard of saddler's (English or western) using post machines. Virtually all sewing is done on flatbeds. If a flatbed wasn't used it was a freearm machine or even a Pearson No.6 might've been employed but anything else is done by hand, traditionally by woman. Frank might be able to shed some light, but I suspect if the machine is that heavy it may have been used for heavy boots, either military or work.

Thanks again for your excellent help.
More power to y'awl
T.

[tomo]

Can anyone tell me the right way to sharpen the blade on an old (sole bend) splitter?
The machine has no markings. It's motorised and on a bench. There's two rollers that feed the leather onto the fixed knife, which is about 8" wide. The bottom roller has dentures along it while the top roller is smooth. I'm sure you know what I'm talking about...
The knife's been sharpened so that the top and bottom bevels are rounded. In my mind this edge would stand up better, but I think the bevels need to be flat, or, even hollow ground. I've stripped the machine down to the bones and have it ready for painting. The knife's as hard as goat's knees, but still needs trueing up ie there's slight wear in the centre. I'll take it to the saw-doctors for sharpening, but want it set up right.
Due to wear, the teeth (grooves) in the bottom roller need recutting, I don't think it's been feeding properly and someone's tried to roughen the top roller to facilitate feeding, some of this could be down to the sharpening too.
What do you think?
More power to y'awl.
T.

[randy]

I have a Tippman Boss stitcher. I use the machine in my leather craft business to sew wallets, purses, belts, holsters ect. Would my Boss work in the construction of western boots?
Thanks

[dw]

Randy,

How heavy a thread will the Boss carry? If you can use something in the neighborhood of 7 cord linen (or the equivalent dacron...never use nylon!) Then the Boss will work fine.

And Welcome to The Crispin Colloqy, BTW

Tight Stitches
DWFII--Member HCC

[dw]

Tom,

I think the blade comes from the factory bevelled on one side only. Every one of these splitting machines I've ever seen or owned has been bevelled one side only. So if it's sharpened on both sides I think you might have problems. A slight hollow grind on the bevel is probably a good thing. Certainly the reverse--a convex surface is not so good. Remember that the thinner the edge (as with a hollow grind) the sharper it will be. The thicker the angle of the bevel, the longer the edge (such as there is) will last.

Tight Stitches
DWFII--Member HCC

[randy]

Tight Stitches,
Thanks for your help
I'm not sure how your thread sizing corolates to mine but I currently use a size 277 thread and my Tippmann Boss will handle up to size 344 thread.
The machine will sew saddles ext. and will sew up to .75" of leather

Randy

[tomo]

Thanks DW,
another concise answer.
Would the bevel be ground on the underside of the knife per chance? (which is opposite to a saddlers bench splitter).

Underneath the knife were two aluminium shims, definately not factory standard. If the blade had been erroneously ground on both sides, then it would need to be shimmed to raise it to the correct height, which is where it would be if the bevel was on the underneath.

More power to y'awl.
T.

[dw]

Tom,

Well, just the opposite on my machine. The blade is supported by a "shelf," locked down on the sides by specially shaped fixtures and in the middle by a simple round headed bolt. And the flat side of the blade rests on the shelf nearly all the way to the lower roller. The bevel is on top.There is very little clearance--almost none--between the edge of the blade and the bottom roller. In fact if the bottom roller were smooth (mine needs to be recut, too) the blade might verywell rest on the roller. that's how the blade is set up to work and it can be adjusted in or out to control that clearance.

Theoretically, the less clearance between the feed roller and the blade the less room for error. Works on skiving machines as well. And if you watch closely the lower roller, being mounted on very stiff springs, will actually be depressed away from the blade as the leather is fed through the machine. So, really, there's no chance of the roller hitting the blade.

If you can't pick up a blade in NZ, you can order them from Pilgrim here in the states.

Tight Stitches
DWFII--Member HCC

[dw]

Randy,

I'm not sure what the equivalents sizes are, either. I might have known once upon a time but I've forgotten now. Just that if the Boss can handle 344, and stitch 3/4" thickness, it will more than handle the job of sideseaming.

That doesn't mean that 344 is the proper size...I think I remember having some 220 in my shop at one time that I thought would work...best advice I can give you is to look at some sole stitching thread (generally 6 or 7 cord is the standard). Sole stitching thread is about the right size. I've known makers to use thinner...and I think it makes for a seam that will rip out more easily; and I've seen heavier...but that's overkill and just makes a thicker sideseam.

Main thing is don't use nylon. It stretches and will not produce a tight seam especially in a machine.

Another two cents to add to the kitty...

Tight Stitches
DWFII--Member HCC

[Randy]

DW:
Thanks for the info, I will play it by ear
Randy

[paul]

Randy,
I don't have a Boss but I am familiar with it.(I've got an Areostitch for side seaming).

The thing I would think would be a concern with the Boss, is that you've got only one hand to hold your work. The other has to be operating the lever, right? It's hard enough sometimes to get the stitch I want with two hands, I can't imagine how difficult it'd be with only one.

Obviously a test seam would reveal the results, but I'd rather go to my curved needle than use a Boss.

Good luck, I for one would be interested in your experience.

PK