Insoles and inseaming

[paul]

Joel,

This has one of my challenges in the past. But you sure seem to be on tract. This looks very usable.

Keep up the good work.

PK

[j1a2g3]

DW
You wrote this in the Gallery under my picture of Dick Anderson stitching awl,

"Push with the palm and never "lever" the awl...you'll break the blade.

" What do you do if the awl tunnels to deep into the insole?

Thanks for your help, Joel

[dw]

Joel,

Stop. Back up. And re-hole not so deep.

Tight Stitches
DWFII--Member HCC

[shoestring]

DW,
What tool did you use to make the narrow hold fast channel?

Ed

[dw]

Ed,

I use an American Channel knife and a welt knife to cut the feather (or outside channel). You could, in a pinch, use a Sutton groover and a French edger or skirt knife.

I use a Sutton Groover or an old, modified Osbourne race to cut the inside channel. You could even use a swivel knife, once you've scribe the distance, in lieu of the race. But with a race you can control the depth of the cut. A race usually is set up to cut a groove...I modified mine to just cut a straight down "slit."

How wide you make your feather and how far in you cut your inside channel determines how wide the holdfast ends up being.

PS...On December first I posted links to some of these tools (see above).

Tight Stitches
DWFII--Member HCC

[j1a2g3]

This is my 1st attemped at "Wiping the toe".

I see two tiny little pipes sticking out under the wiping strip on the toe. They look alot bigger in the picture.

I think the toe box came out nicely and I can't notice any ridge under the vamp.

PS: I pulled the toe bug because I didn't like it.

Any comments would be greatly appreciated, Joel

4657.jpg

4658.jpg

[dw]

Joel,

Looks pretty good. And good on you for trying it.

The only thing I would say (and I hope it's constructive) is that your wiping strip and the tacks that hold it should be right over the feather.

Unless you're doing a cement construction or a pegged sole, wiping that far away from the edge is counterproductive. Those pipes would not be anywhere near a problem (if they even are) if the wiping strip were over the feather. The tacks would have been driven into the feather and the wiping strip would have forced the shallow end of the pipes back and behind the wiping strip.

Also, going around the toe, especially, more tacks are better.

Anyway...keep at it, you getting it.

Tight Stitches
DWFII--Member HCC

[j1a2g3]

DW

Do you skive the edge of the welt? Is the skive on the grain or flesh side? What would be the angle of your skive? How far in is the stitching grove from the edge?

I have tried to split 50# monofliament and have had no luck. Is there a trick to it? I made my tapers with monofilament, teklon and homemade handwax just by wrapping the teklon around the monofilament as you discribe in your book. I tried and can't pull the bristle out of the taper but I would like to see if I could make the bristles with the split ones.

Also, why can't the tapered ends touch the floor? How do you keep 6 feet of thread going through the holdfast without changing your grip?

Any advance would be greatly appreciated, Joel

[dw]

Joel,

If you buy a yard of Barbours men's weight welting and look at it...well I make my welting exactly the same. Just better.

I'll tell you a secret...well, not exactly a secret because I do include that description for doing the "wrap" method of attaching a bristle...especially for someone just getting started the wrap method may be the best option. It's easier on the hands because it is smoother than the braided bristle.

Splitting the bristle is simply a matter of the right kind of mono--Maxima...fresh maxima...works well--and a keen eye for starting the split. If you're getting started but the mono is not splitting it may be that the mono is old or of a more "tangled" type of polymer. Try a different brand...and more expensive is not the best way to go.

Well, here's another secret...I allow my waxed ends to hit the floor. Of course I sweep up good before I start inseaming. I just got into a bad habit and have never been able to break it, but I can--as I was demonstrating to my current student--inseam and never allow the bristles to hit the floor. You can easily change your grip on the major part of the thread without ever letting go of the bristles (except of course when feeding them through the holes). I know it sounds impossible but it can be done.

Tight Stitches
DWFII--Member HCC

[j1a2g3]

This is a pic of my wrapped bristle.

4691.jpg

I got the wrapped bristles through the 1st hole. Then, on the second hole, the one bristle pulled out. I tried rewrapping the bristle but that didn't work.

It took a long time and a lot of @$#%^$^ to pull the teklon thread out of the holdfast. So I don't think it is the handwax. I will try agian tomorrow when I don't feel so rushed.

Dw thanks for all your help, Joel

[dw]

Joel,

Try this...first, beeswax the wrappings and about 12 inches more of the thread. Second, feed one bristle in such that only the clear tip of the bristle is in the hole and none of the wraps are even close to the hole. Feed the other bristle in so that it is positioned in the same manner. Now, holding one bristle firmly, so that it cannot moove, pull the other one through and about twelve inches more. Then grasp the unfed bristle and a portion of the trailing thread from the first bristle and pull both together to bring the second bristle through.

This procedure will reinforce the second bristle as it goes through the (now filled with thread) hole. Repeat this procedure for several more holes. By the end of that time, the wraps should be well burnished and smoothed out so that you can pull on both bristles simultaneously, if you want.

That said, due to a bout with tennis elbow a year or two ago, I started using this technique and have never gone back. It is simple, almost as fast as pulling both bristles at the same time, and reduces the strain on the wraps.

Also just to cover all bases...be sure to rough your bristle up with a moderate sandpaper (100 grit) and wax that portion of the bristle before wrapping.

If the wax is still sticky to the touch after it has sat for an hour or so, it is probably too soft and may indeed be the root of your problem.

Another quick tip...boars bristles seldom got much beyond 8 inches long and 4-6 was more like it. But you can cut mono any length you like. I make my bristles 15 inches long and allow myself at least six inches of clear bristle at the tip to pull on. Why stint?

Tight Stitches
DWFII--Member HCC

[chuck_deats]

Joel,

For what it's worth, spliting mono is a pain. Agree with DW, some mono works, some does not (Shakespeare does not). Cheaper and fresher seems better. Here is technique that has worked for me most of the time: (Seems to work better on the first new moon after the spring soltice)

Cut a piece of mono one and a half to two feet long. About six inches from one end, lay the mono over a curved surface (small anvil horn or curved surface of a vice) and rap with a hammer to flatten slightly. With a utility knife, make an angled cut in the flattened area to the center of the long end of the mono. Grasp this notched piece with a pair of plyers and the six inch long tail in the other hand and give it a yank to start. Slow pull does not seem to work as well as a quick jerk. Continue the split to whatever length you want the tails to be. Trim off the flattened area and the six inch tail.

If everything is going right, you will get 50 to 80% success. Sometimes, straightening the mono over the edge of a board seems to help. Once you get a system going, make up a lifetime supply so you will not have to go through this drill again. They store just fine in a plastic bag.

Chuck

[j1a2g3]

Dw & Chuck

Thanks for the advice.

Once you have made your bristle do you let the handwax setup before you start inseaming?

Joel

[j1a2g3]

Here's a picture of my 1st attempt at inseaming.

Comments welcomed and needed, Joel

4693.jpg

[dw]

Joel,

You've got the right idea that's for sure. It's a pretty good job.

I would only make two comments...and hope they help.

First, in my opinion, you've trimmed the vamp just a little too far back on both the medial and lateral side. I would like to see the vamp be at least half an inch in front of the last welt stitch before it turns into the shank cavity. As you have it there is a possibility (not a certainty) that water or dirt can leak into the insole between the end of the welt and the vamp.

Also it looks like you fed both bristles through the last hole on the medial side. I'm not even sure how you did that as the medial side should have been the side you started on for the right boot. But there appears to be a stitch thrown over the edge of the vamp. If you had trimmed the vamp further forward, that would have been a huge, long stitch.

Just some thoughts for the future.... In the present, it's a dern good job for the first time out.

Tight Stitches
DWFII--Member HCC

[j1a2g3]

DW,

Thanks for the comments and your words of incouragement.

I did start on the medial side. I just didn't figure out how to do the whip stitching in the shank cavity until I did my 1st stitch and then I noticed it wasn't right. I just couldn't figure out how to pull the stitch out without splicing the thread with one or both bristles.

I got a lot better at hitting my mark on the welt as I progressed around the shoe. Also, remembering to spray water on the holdfast helps the process go alot smoother.

Joel

[j1a2g3]

Ok, here is my second attempt at inseaming on the left insole.

I had already cut the vamp on both insoles so I couldn't correct that problem. I did fix the first stitch on the medial side and the beginning of the whip stitching.

Any comments would be greatly appreciated, Joel

4695.jpg

(Message edited by j1a2g3 on January 25, 2007)

[j1a2g3]

I was wondering if I started and ended the welt too far forward? Should I have started the welt farther back and brought it further into instep on the ball or medial side? Should the holdfast have curved more around the ball?

Thanks for any advice, Joel

[dw]

Joel,

I believe that the medial side is either a little too far towards the heel or the lateral side is not far enough towards the heel. Remember that the treadline is roughly at a 15° angle and the ends of the welt should reflect that.

Of course, that's for a western boot...with a pegged shank. Shoes are almost always welted to the breast of the heel, at the least, and often all the way around.

Tight Stitches
DWFII--Member HCC

[j1a2g3]

DW

I think I have too much leather under the front part of the welt. I don't think I trimed the toe box enough. How far back do you trim the toe box?
Do you make another feather in the toe box after it is on? How do you then keep the leather from buidling up in that part of the shoe?

Thanks Joel

[dw]

Joel,

Yes, I make another feather in the toe box. Especially if the toe box is hard leather, this feather must be cut into the toe box when you've done with shaping. If the toe box is thin leather or some other material [sniff] the toe box material can be driven into the insole feather with the pane of a shoemakers hammer or, better, the pane of a London Pattern hammer.

Theoretically, you could probably...maybe...perhaps...remove your toebox material from the feather entirely. I don't--I cut it to leave a fairly thin layer in and over the insole feather--but if it's cemented or adhered to the lining, it probably doesn't need to go any further than the edge of the feather. I've never heard of nor seen anyone doing it that way but I bet there's more than one that does.

Tight Stitches
DWFII--Member HCC

[paul]

Here's my latest bit of inseaming practice. (It's all practice, you know)

4800.jpg

My method of inseaming is way different since attending DW's seminar. This was the one area I need his special attention. ANd while the lesson in his shop was a painful one for me, (many failures), I have since had the time to improve greatly.

DW, I may be spoiled on the Vesta Pech stitching wax you turned me on to. All others will have to measure up. Too bad it's no longer available.

I did get a knot in one strand during the process. No way it was coming out, so I just fussed over each stitch, pulling it hard thru each hole. I wondered if it would enlarge the hole over much?

I also had trouble finding the hole for the inside end, but when I started waxing the hole with beeswax on my awl each time, it made a diffference.

And can you believe it! On the last hole of the wraps in the heel seat, I broke the awl! Of course, I should have been using an inseaming awl, rather than a stitching awl. I'm sure there would have been less tendency to pry.

Learning the hard way,

PK

[dw]

Paul,

Looks good!! I'd guess the vamp was bullhide? Shank stitches might be a tad too far apart for my druthers (especially on the left boot) but we all develop our own "look" no matter where we start or who we learn from.

I'm real pleased you are getting the hang of it...and don't think that even after 35 years, I don't get knots and other "issues" coming up, occasionally, too.


Tight Stitches
DWFII--HCC Member

[paul]

DW,

Thank you.

I have a different feeling about the boots I may be working on when I know they're "pretty" inside and under the soles. Quite a different perspective from the years of doing shoe repair.

Back to practicin',

PK

[jesselee]

Hey Y'all, Anyone here ever use a chainstitch hook for welts inseaming? It's a curved hook. I have used it, curved needles and 'hard ends'. They are pretty old school. Soak a cord such as Barbours #7 linen in shellac, about 6 inches for a few hours. Then pull through scrap leather to rid of the excess. Twist while you do this, and dont forget to feather the tip to a point. Let 'em dry and when almost dry, mold 'em to shape. Have not used a hog bristle in years, I prefer harness needles and I heat, shape, quench and polish my own. Never used a synthetic thread or that monofiliment thang y'all speak of. Thats decades out of my time... Wells (H.G.)left me here when I didn't get his boots to him in time!!!!LOL

Jesse