Insoles and inseaming

Share secrets, compare techniques, discuss the merits of materials--eg. veg vs. chrome--and above all, seek knowledge.
Post Reply
Message
Author
artzend
7
7
Posts: 519
Joined: Sat Feb 10, 2007 10:00 am
Full Name: Tim Skyrme
Location: Agnes Water, Queensland, Australia
Been Liked: 2 times
Contact:

Re: Insoles and inseaming

#301 Post by artzend »

Nick

It looks like shankboard glued to the insole. Probably for strength and/or stiffness. The lasts look fairly low heeled so I am not sure why it was done.

Tim
User avatar
producthaus
3
3
Posts: 96
Joined: Sat Apr 03, 2010 12:52 pm
Full Name: Nick Hausman
Location: San Francisco, CA, USA
Contact:

Re: Insoles and inseaming

#302 Post by producthaus »

I recently got a sample of insole from Warkov Safeer in which the grain surface feels really soft, like you could use that for the finished product. Some questions come up :

1 - is it normal to use naked insole leather to finish the inside of the shoe, rather than apply a sock liner?

2 - how do you get around having a bunch of nail holes in the insole from the lasting/molding process? I might try using cheese cloth instead of nails to mold the insole.

3 - do you NEED to apply an oil or other type of finishing substance to the insole. If it isn't a need, then what are some common substances used to condition or adjust the aesthetic look, i.e., give it a bit of shine?
User avatar
romango
8
8
Posts: 854
Joined: Wed Apr 18, 2007 1:40 pm
Full Name: Rick Roman
Location: Eugene, Oregon, USA
Been Liked: 8 times
Contact:

Re: Insoles and inseaming

#303 Post by romango »

Nick,

It is actually preferable to use the naked insole leather for maximum moisture absorbing capability.

If you use a sock liner, the glue will prevent such good moisture handling. However, for appearance, you may want to add one.

You don't need to add oil to the insole but you can add tallow. This will actually make it somewhat shiny. The theory is that this will make the insole last longer. This is perhaps more relevant in heavily used footwear like work boots.

I use Vet-Wrap to mold the insole to the bottom of the last. This leaves no nail hols. There are 3 nail holes to hole the insole on, however.
User avatar
courtney
6
6
Posts: 333
Joined: Tue Feb 24, 2009 12:46 am
Full Name: courtney schamach
Location: petaluma, california, u.s.a.

Re: Insoles and inseaming

#304 Post by courtney »

You still have to use nails to last the shoe anyway right, so I dont know how you'd get around holes.
User avatar
romango
8
8
Posts: 854
Joined: Wed Apr 18, 2007 1:40 pm
Full Name: Rick Roman
Location: Eugene, Oregon, USA
Been Liked: 8 times
Contact:

Re: Insoles and inseaming

#305 Post by romango »

Well. one or two visible nail hole is better than 30 but, if you want a totally finished look, you'll need the sock liner.
User avatar
producthaus
3
3
Posts: 96
Joined: Sat Apr 03, 2010 12:52 pm
Full Name: Nick Hausman
Location: San Francisco, CA, USA
Contact:

Re: Insoles and inseaming

#306 Post by producthaus »

can you last the upper without puncturing the lasting nails/tacks all the way through the insole?
User avatar
romango
8
8
Posts: 854
Joined: Wed Apr 18, 2007 1:40 pm
Full Name: Rick Roman
Location: Eugene, Oregon, USA
Been Liked: 8 times
Contact:

Re: Insoles and inseaming

#307 Post by romango »

I don't think so.
artzend
7
7
Posts: 519
Joined: Sat Feb 10, 2007 10:00 am
Full Name: Tim Skyrme
Location: Agnes Water, Queensland, Australia
Been Liked: 2 times
Contact:

Re: Insoles and inseaming

#308 Post by artzend »

Nick

I always used a sole press to fit the insole to the last when it was wet, leave it then and it dries to shape ok.

Tacks leave a smaller hole, and cement lasting is the only way to do it without any holes except at the seat and toe, which require the pleating.

You would probably still need a seat sock, but that is all.

DW,

If you get the last into the forepart of the shoe and insert the shoe horn (preferably plastic) into the back of the shoe, then as you pull up on the toe of the last, pull down on the shoe horn and it will slip on easily. It should anyway.

Tim
www.shoemakingbook.com
User avatar
dw
Seanchaidh
Posts: 5830
Joined: Wed Jan 01, 1997 10:00 am
Full Name: DWFII
Location: Redmond, OR
Has Liked: 204 times
Been Liked: 122 times
Contact:

Re: Insoles and inseaming

#309 Post by dw »

Tim,

Why plastic?

Tight Stitches
DWFII--HCC Member
artzend
7
7
Posts: 519
Joined: Sat Feb 10, 2007 10:00 am
Full Name: Tim Skyrme
Location: Agnes Water, Queensland, Australia
Been Liked: 2 times
Contact:

Re: Insoles and inseaming

#310 Post by artzend »

DW

Because it is flexible. I tried it with a metal shoehorn that I had that was about the same size as a plastic one and apart from it bending and staying bent, it was too rigid as it came to pull it from the shoe.

Tim
hidesmith
3
3
Posts: 137
Joined: Fri Jan 29, 1999 10:00 am
Full Name: Bruce Graham

Re: Insoles and inseaming

#311 Post by hidesmith »

I am making a shoe for a customer who wants a storm welted sole. Since I am much better at rolling the edges of the thinner innersole than I am at channeling, I am attempting a marriage of the two. I also like the idea of a thinner overall sole - the idea being comfort and flexibility.

Has anyone experimented thus? If so, how did it work?
fishball
2
2
Posts: 55
Joined: Mon Dec 15, 2008 11:47 pm
Full Name: Alexander A. W. W. Yu
Location: Hong Kong, Hong Kong

Re: Insoles and inseaming

#312 Post by fishball »

What kind of welting is this? Can anyone help?
If have some pictures to show the construction will be the best, thanks.

(Message edited by fishball on October 14, 2010)

(Message edited by fishball on October 14, 2010)
fishball
2
2
Posts: 55
Joined: Mon Dec 15, 2008 11:47 pm
Full Name: Alexander A. W. W. Yu
Location: Hong Kong, Hong Kong

Re: Insoles and inseaming

#313 Post by fishball »

Sorry, my mistake. Here the picture:
11694.jpg
You do not have the required permissions to view the files attached to this post.
User avatar
dearbone
8
8
Posts: 1032
Joined: Fri Oct 12, 2007 12:23 pm
Full Name: Nasser Vies
Location: Toronto, Ontario, Canada
Been Liked: 3 times

Re: Insoles and inseaming

#314 Post by dearbone »

I think it is the Norwegian style welting,Marcel posted picture/s of it last year sometimes and i if memory is correct,It is under "Bottoming techniques", Good luck.

Nasser
User avatar
dearbone
8
8
Posts: 1032
Joined: Fri Oct 12, 2007 12:23 pm
Full Name: Nasser Vies
Location: Toronto, Ontario, Canada
Been Liked: 3 times

Re: Insoles and inseaming

#315 Post by dearbone »

Alexander,

Who is the maker of the shoe above? Thanks.
janne_melkersson
5
5
Posts: 225
Joined: Wed Sep 09, 2009 9:00 am
Full Name: Jan-Erik Melkersson
Location: Östersund, Jämtland, Sweden
Been Liked: 1 time
Contact:

Re: Insoles and inseaming

#316 Post by janne_melkersson »

Alexander,
I don't know what they call this style in English becasue there is no welt involved in the making but if it is then it's called as Nasser said Norwegian welted. Here in Sweden we call it pitch seamed with or without welt. The reason for that is thes method where mostly used for heave duty boots like army and farmers boots and the tread needed to be covered with a lot of pitch.

Here is a two photos where you can see some of the making. It is made of reversed waxed calf and JP Myhre, Oslo treated the skin with wax for me.
11696.jpg

11697.jpg
You do not have the required permissions to view the files attached to this post.
fishball
2
2
Posts: 55
Joined: Mon Dec 15, 2008 11:47 pm
Full Name: Alexander A. W. W. Yu
Location: Hong Kong, Hong Kong

Re: Insoles and inseaming

#317 Post by fishball »

Nasser,

Stefano Bemer is the shoemaker.
hidesmith
3
3
Posts: 137
Joined: Fri Jan 29, 1999 10:00 am
Full Name: Bruce Graham

Re: Insoles and inseaming

#318 Post by hidesmith »

Alexander's shoe looks like one of Limmer's single-seam shoes. They make/made the shoe with the closing seam on the inside near the heel. The Limmers use a Norwegian welt in their hiking boots, so it may well be one of theirs.
User avatar
producthaus
3
3
Posts: 96
Joined: Sat Apr 03, 2010 12:52 pm
Full Name: Nick Hausman
Location: San Francisco, CA, USA
Contact:

Re: Insoles and inseaming

#319 Post by producthaus »

I am thinking this was not the easiest method for molding the insole - the 3oz tacks are very hard to get out.

I was wondering if it's a bit easier to use a larger tack, like 8oz, hammer it in half way, then hammer the tack over on its side?
11868.jpg
You do not have the required permissions to view the files attached to this post.
lancepryor
7
7
Posts: 662
Joined: Wed Mar 31, 2004 6:42 am
Full Name: lance pryor
Been Liked: 3 times

Re: Insoles and inseaming

#320 Post by lancepryor »

Nick:

I do the latter. Furthermore, I find bending the nails over the outside helps to shape the edge of the insole to the feather line of the last.

Lance
artzend
7
7
Posts: 519
Joined: Sat Feb 10, 2007 10:00 am
Full Name: Tim Skyrme
Location: Agnes Water, Queensland, Australia
Been Liked: 2 times
Contact:

Re: Insoles and inseaming

#321 Post by artzend »

Nick

It is easier to use a 1.25mm x 25mm bullet head nail. They will bend easily once they have gripped into the last and are easily removed. They only leave a small hole and don't normally damage the last.

Tim
www.shoemakingbook.com
danfreeman
3
3
Posts: 130
Joined: Wed Mar 17, 2004 10:00 am
Full Name: Dan Freeman

Re: Insoles and inseaming

#322 Post by danfreeman »

Those black spots are areas where the leather's been damaged. Can you use brass tacks, or blued brads instead? I've had good luck with an Ace-type bandage, no nails at all. It increases the existing problem of drying the insole before mold appears, though, so helping the drying along with a fan is usually needed.
User avatar
romango
8
8
Posts: 854
Joined: Wed Apr 18, 2007 1:40 pm
Full Name: Rick Roman
Location: Eugene, Oregon, USA
Been Liked: 8 times
Contact:

Re: Insoles and inseaming

#323 Post by romango »

With the right tool, the nails are not hard to get out. However... I don't like using nails at all. It's a lot of unnecessary holes in your insole and last.

I'm a big fan of "Vet-Wrap". This stuff, or various knock off brands are readily available at any farm and feed store. Heck, they use it at my doctors office too!
11876.jpg
You do not have the required permissions to view the files attached to this post.
fishball
2
2
Posts: 55
Joined: Mon Dec 15, 2008 11:47 pm
Full Name: Alexander A. W. W. Yu
Location: Hong Kong, Hong Kong

Re: Insoles and inseaming

#324 Post by fishball »

My friend used bicycle inner tyre to do it
11878.jpg
You do not have the required permissions to view the files attached to this post.
janne_melkersson
5
5
Posts: 225
Joined: Wed Sep 09, 2009 9:00 am
Full Name: Jan-Erik Melkersson
Location: Östersund, Jämtland, Sweden
Been Liked: 1 time
Contact:

Re: Insoles and inseaming

#325 Post by janne_melkersson »

I form my insoles using an old sole press. The result is very good and it is clean, fast, and no nails are needed. I don't know if these are available in the US but if you found one buy it.
Janne
11880.jpg
You do not have the required permissions to view the files attached to this post.
Post Reply