Tools of the Trade

[amuckart]

The knife in use for making Dutch clogs here: http://www.britishpathe.com/record.php?id=1784 looks pretty similar to the sort of knife used to make lasts. Unlike a British clogmaker's stock knife it is used to cut inside (concave) curves, similar to those found on lasts. Please correct me if I'm wrong, Trefor, but in british clogmaking the stock knife only cuts outside (convex) curves, with the hollower used to cut the concave surfaces.

[trefor_owen]

So I am now in a quandary: if I make any comment/response I will severley shorten my brief interlude on this list? how do I proceed or explain a different sense of humour then?
Trefor

[trefor_owen]

Alasdair;
Yes mostly correct!
The set of knifes used by the clogmaker (as opposed to the block maker) consists of the Stock knife - the broad blade which does all rough work/edge/underside work, the Hollower - a as the name suggestes curved blade which cuts the surfaces which come into contact with the foot, and a Gripper which cuts the channel/rebate around the edge to accept the leather upper.
Trefor

[trefor_owen]

Geri,
Last time I asked a Smith re replicating these knifes the estiamte was £200 plus each knife... certainly when last in commercial production (around 1930's from th eold trade catalogues I have) they were the equivalent to one weeks wage for the user.
Trefor

[admin]

How about this...

You read the rules; you solemnly resolve to do your best to abide by them; you familiarize yourself with the tools the forum provides to make life easier for all of us--Test areas, emoticons to indicate humour, etc.; you take advantage of the ability to bring any questions of protocol or formatting, etc., to Admin (or one of the other moderators) in a PM or email before it becomes a problem...

and we all forget about it.

??

Yr. Hmb Svt.

PS...further public discussion of this narrow issue will be considered OT (off topic)

(Message edited by admin on December 01, 2010)

[trefor_owen]

I have a video by Sam Hannah (a respected documtentary maker) re clogmaking circa 1949 ish.. but have no idea how to send the link. It exists in my docs on this comp but cant transfer that link via my email thingy to this box.. suggestions?

[amuckart]

Hi Trefor,

How big is the file? If it is small enough it can be posted on the "Cinema Verite" topic of the forum, though I can't at this moment put my hands on the instructions on how to do so.

The alternative is that you could attach it to an email and send it to me, and I can turn it into a format suitable for uploading here.

Cheers.

[admin]

Trefor, Alasdair,

Videos are best converted to .wmv or .mov format and sent to admin for posting.

Be aware that videos sent or uploaded to the HCC are stored on HCC servers. Those running longer than 15 minutes are server space and bandwidth hogs.

And alternative is to store the video on a remote site (such as Youtube...although I am not endorsing Youtube) and create a link to it.

Emmett...reveling in the roar of the greasepaint and the smell of the crowd

[lancepryor]

Here are some pictures of my stitch markers. All appear to be homemade. The ends have a 'V' shaped groove cut between the two sides that make the impression on the welt. One of these is an 11 SPI, while the other 3 are all about 16 SPI.

12709.jpg

12710.jpg

12711.jpg

12712.jpg

Lance

[romango]

I've used nylon fish line, blunt needles and pig bristles and I keep coming back to the steel bristles. I don't know of anyone currently selling them and I've never liked the quality of purchased bristles anyway.

Now I make my own from guitar strings and they are quite superior!

I posted a short video on how to make steel bristles on YouTube: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vqiYJ-4dxUU

[gshoes]

Great video Rick. I can't wait to give it a try. Do they break easily?

Geri

[romango]

They never break. The 2 legs might separate under abuse but no more than ones I've purchased. They tend to have more spring than purchased ones too. Which is a good thing.

[lancepryor]

Rick:

Very interesting.

What do you use these for -- inseaming?
Outseaming? (They would seem to big for a very high stitch count [e.g. 10 spi] and holes made with a small square awl.(?))

What technique do you use for inseaming, ie. do you pull one thread all the way through, then 'retrograde' it with the other bristle, or do you pull the two bristles through simultaneously, or what? Does the extra thickness of the double thread near the eye ever cause a problem?

How do you attach the cord -- the standard leather working manner of piercing the end of the piece that went through the eye bristle?
Perhaps a couple of follow on videos would be a good idea.....

Thanks,
Lance

[dw]

Rick,

It's a nice technique. I wonder if silver solder would work? What kind of solder did you use in the video?

I used to get soldered bristles from Goetz years ago--far superior to what they offered in latter years and/or what they might be offering now.

However, I never could get the hang of using steel bristles for inseaming although I know many good makers who use them. They just won't "turn the corner" in my hands the way a boar's bristle or nylon bristle will.

Still, there are times when it is handy to have steel bristles around...for odd ball pick-up jobs where making up a waxed end would be overkill, for instance. There I use guitar strings, as well, and make twisted bristles. Of course, they are a lot harder on your hands than soldered bristles.

Tight Stitches
DWFII--HCC Member

[romango]

I use steel bristles for inseaming and outseaming. It is the thinnest needle format available AFAIK.

12801.jpg

I fold the thread through the bristle loop at a taw thickness such that the thread is nearly the same size as the bristle where they join.
Then I simply wrap the taw around itself several times, punch a hole lower down and thread the needle through.

I thread both bristle through the awl holes before pulling the thread through.

Originally I thought I would want silver solder as it would be stronger, but I found regular (lead free) electrical solder works fine. Silver solder would require higher temperatures but perhaps it would be worth it for the bragging rights.

The guitar strings have lots of spring but will hold a bend too. I simple bend them the shape of the awl and they glide through holes easily. You can also easily adjust the bend for a difficult hole. And.. in a really tough situation, you can catch the tip of one bristle in the loop crotch of the other to get the second bristle through.

This technique requires lots of practice to avoid slitting the bristle but I only rarely need it.

[dw]

Rick,

I use steel bristles for inseaming and outseaming. It is the thinnest needle format available AFAIK.

Well, I am not disparaging your technique. Nor would I want to contend with you as to the "proper" or "best" approach, but I must disagree with the idea that guitar string is the thinnest format. Monofilament fishing line comes in many diameters, some of it thinner than the thinnest gauge guitar string, nevermind that the guitar string needs to be folded...effectively doubling its diameter. [It also come in varying stiffnesses--"hard" or "soft" nylon]

I have round closed with two strands of Teklon and I have experimented with one strand. In each case, I have bristled with nylon of an appropriate diameter.

What is appropriate diameter? Small enough that I can wrap the bristle with sufficient wraps to establish strength but such that two wrapped bristles passing by each other in a hole do not exceed the diameter of the thread itself.

A final note...again not to be contrary just to weigh the pros and cons..."turning the corner" is not, in my mind, the bending of the bristle such that it "holds" a predetermined curve (although that may be a functional equivalent). Rather it is the ability of the bristle to follow a curved path without being bent into a static shape.

It is a misconception...and one widely held, I suspect...that a boars bristle can or ought to be handled like a steel bristle. But this only leads to too much force being introduced. A boars bristle (or nylon) bristle cannot be forced. It must be allowed to find its own way through the hole. It must be gently seduced.

Forgive me if I have come across a bit contentious, I do not intend it in that spirit.

And I do thank you for the evaluation of solder.

Tight Stitches
DWFII--HCC Member

[ccs]

If you used a true silver solder (ie, a "hard solder" such as 56% silver), you'd have to heat the wire with a torch to something not that much short of a dull red heat, losing the temper of the steel. Soft solder, including that with a few percent silver such as sta-brite, may avoid that.

[dw]

Good point. I have used silver solder...many years ago when I was making silver jewelry. I recall using a torch. I hadn't thought how that would affect the temper of the steel.



Tight Stitches
DWFII--HCC Member

[romango]

I suspected that "thinnest" comment might draw some fire! Notice I added AFAIK (as far as I know). There are even thinner guitar strings I have yet to try (as I have no need yet).

In my hands, wrapping the taw to the fish line created more bulk than I wanted. I realize that my technique, in this regard, was not all that good.

The steel bristle can also follow the path to some degree. I think there is a trade off. The steel bristle can be bent to approximate the curvature of the hole and then follow slightly.

The fish line cannot be shaped much but follows well.

In addition, the steel bristle can occasionally push past an obstacle.

This is just my preference. I have tried the other methods several times but I don't consider myself the master of any.

Maybe I'm just lazy but it seems the steel bristle is far easier to attach. It only takes me about 30 seconds to do and requires not much skill. But I recognize that, once you know how to do something well, it doesn't seem so hard.

[tomo]

Rick,
could it be that the ends of the steel bristles fowl on the internal edges of the hole. It seems to me that no matter how you finish them there is always a rough bit on the end, at least when I've tried them in the past. Just a thought...

Actually I think I tried it with banjo strings. Yes. I'd taken the banjo off the end first!

More power to y'awl
Tom.

[ccs]

If you did use hard silver solder, you'd end up with something that could be filed and to a limited degree hammer forged almost as if it were a single piece of metal.

It might be possible to bring the fold only part way back to the point, and even to keep the point cool (under water?) to preserve the temper while silver soldering a joint further back, then file taper that joint.

(Message edited by ccs on January 30, 2011)

(Message edited by ccs on January 30, 2011)

[jesselee]

Where can I get one of those 'chisel knives' like the Japanese shoe maker used, and wha is their proper name.

Chees,

JesseLee

[marika_vchasse]

Hi JesseLee - I ordered one from this website:
http://www.goodsjapan.jp
I ordered the one with a straight blade and
angular edges.
JAPANESE SKIFE SKIVE BEVELER LEATHER CRAFT KNIFE
Item# 120564712086
There are also some with rounded edges and angled blades on this website.
It seems to me that on the videos I've seen so far they are using the one I've ordered (with angular edge/straight blade).
Hope that is the one you are looking for - good luck -
Marika!

[jesselee]

Anne,

Thanks for that. I'll be ordering one. The one I saw in the video was without the wooden handle and was very long.

Cheers,

JesseLee

[dw]

Jesse,

Forgive me if I am mis-reading you but I think you are conflating the skiving knife in the video with the knife he used to trim the linings.

I have not seen a knife like he used for trimming the linings at any of the Japanese sites.

A narrow French skive is probably the best knife of all to do that job.

These can be found used on Ebay or, IINM, Osbourne makes a French skive in a number of widths. A one-eighths inch wide French skive works great.

Tight Stitches
DWFII--HCC Member